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INTRODUCTION

In this conversation on Naturally Curious, host Bruce C. Bryan speaks with Theresa Dorlini about CIRCLE Design Studio’s integrated approach to architecture, interior design, and construction. They explore how the firm works with clients, the influence of landscape on design, the creative process behind furniture and product design, and why trust and curiosity matter.

Editorial note: Edited from the supplied transcript for readability. Filler, false starts, repeated station identifications, and broadcast transitions have been removed. The interview reflects the time of its original recording; its date was not supplied.

RECOGNITION AND THE EVOLUTION OF CIRCLE

Bruce: Theresa Dorlini, thank you for being my guest on the show, and welcome.

Theresa Dorlini: Thank you for having me.

Bruce C. Bryan: So your work and your company's work has been recognized nationally. Will you talk about that a little bit?

Theresa Dorlini: Yeah. Our firm, CIRCLE Design Studio, is an architecture and design firm, design build. We are licensed interior designers, architects, and a Class A contractor. We just have a holistic approach to design. We like to say that we are interior designers who think like architects, architects who think like builders, and builders who think like designers.

Bruce C. Bryan: So that's why it's a circle.

Theresa Dorlini: Yes. The full circle process, and holistic.

Bruce C. Bryan: So I know you don't do the work to win awards. But it must be gratifying when that happens, yes?

Theresa Dorlini: I think it's always nice to be recognized. There's certain awards that I think mean more than others. Some of the ones that we're really proud of are the IDEAS awards, which are ASID and IIDA, that are being judged by your peers. So it's one thing to have sort of the general public love your work, but to be recognized amongst other designers is really nice.

Bruce C. Bryan: So we'd maybe talk about your firm a little bit. 20 years now, but there must be some ebbs and flows, especially in a situation with a creative company like yours that's been around 20 years.

Theresa Dorlini: Yeah. Besides just regular economic upturn or downturn, our firm started out 20 years ago and really, my husband John and I were just young and dumb, and sometimes that's what it takes to go out there. You don’t know any better, right? Knowing a lot about design and knowing about the type of firm we wanted to build, but maybe not knowing a lot about business. But I think, in the beginning when you're starting out, you take almost everything. You kind of have to. But I think you do a good job on the small projects and you earn people's trust and that's kind of how it grows over time.

Bruce C. Bryan: And leads to other introductions and other projects and other types of work, right? Grows organically.

Theresa Dorlini: Yeah.

DESIGN TRENDS: RESIDENTIAL COMFORT IN COMMERCIAL SPACES

Bruce C. Bryan: Have you seen some trends, maybe patterns to things, not just with your company but even in the industry. What's happening in the industry these days?

Theresa Dorlini: I think there's so many things are happening and obviously–

Bruce C. Bryan: And of course I have to say which industry 'cause you're involved in three different industries under one umbrella, right?

Theresa Dorlini: Yeah. Design in general is always growing, changing. I think in terms of furniture or home furnishings, that's been an interesting thing. And since our firm is multidisciplinary but also we do almost every project type so, everything from corporate to healthcare we've won awards for, and then high-end residential. I think you see kind of how the market changes and what you need. But say in furnishings, it used to be that there was a clear line between commercial furnishings and home furnishings. Now it's very, you know, the term “resimercial”, “respitality”.

Bruce C. Bryan: Interesting.

Theresa Dorlini: And that's a shift in terms of people and the work environment becoming a little more casual and people, the younger generation, wanting that living room feel instead of feeling like they're all buttoned up and stiff. And we were seeing that, I would say, at least 10 years ago, and I think being able to touch so many different sectors in design helped me because when that was emerging, there weren't a lot of designers who…you were either a corporate designer or you were a residential designer. But then when you have all these corporate projects that want a residential look, who do you turn to?

Bruce C. Bryan: Yeah. And so you had that generalist approach that probably served you well. You're listening to Naturally Curious, by the way. I'm Bruce Bryan. This is Theresa Dorlini from CIRCLE Design Studio. When I travel, let's say you go to a hotel, maybe a boutique hotel, more and more of them are feeling like somebody's home, like you just described. And a comfortable workplace, I would guess probably since COVID, since people were working remotely, they tend to have some characteristics of comfort as well, and that's becoming probably a trend that you were just talking about, right?

Theresa Dorlini: Yeah. I think, especially as the workforce gets younger, I think what they value is very different. So whereas you might have the Boomers who really valued that corner office and the big executive desk, the younger kids wanna be able to plop their feet up and sit in a beanbag chair with a laptop and have mobility. They don't wanna be stuck to just one desk. It's just the value system has changed.

CLIENT-FOCUSED DESIGN AND PERSONAL QUESTIONS

Bruce C. Bryan: I guess I was thinking more about the residential side. How would you describe your approach, or I should say your company's approach, whether it is commercial or residential? How would you describe it?

Theresa Dorlini: I think we're very client-focused. I've never been a designer who could just do me. I really dig into what the client wants, so in residential design that's really digging deep into how they're gonna use the space. We get into lots of deep questions. We call them programming questions, and that's really to draw out what the client needs and their aesthetic needs, functional needs. We get into the nitty-gritty. But our approach is always client-focused and figuring out and helping them interpret everything that they want into a physical space.

Bruce C. Bryan: It's interesting to me because in that scenario, you probably are getting into people's spaces, not just physically, but into their emotional space, into their mental space. I bet you ask some questions. You call them programming questions. And I don't wanna get any big trade secrets, but can you tell me one or two questions you might ask somebody where you're in their house asking them a question and they're startled or shocked or they're thinking, "Why do you wanna know this?" Yes. I'd love to hear that. That sounds interesting to me.

Theresa Dorlini: There are so many of those. When you're working with, say, a couple and designing the primary suite, the primary bath. They're pretty intimate questions where you're like, "Are you ever gonna shower together?" "How many shower heads do we need? How are we gonna do this?" I think by the time we get to that, we've already had enough interaction with them, and I think we're not, quote-unquote, "friends" with the clients by this point. But I think we put them at ease so that they can answer those questions because if they don't feel like they can trust you or know you, it feels a little weird. And they're like, "Why are you asking me if we shower together?" I'm like, "Well, hey, how are we gonna know the size of the shower and the other things that you're gonna need?"

Bruce C. Bryan: That's a great question and a great example, so thank you for answering that. You're listening to Naturally Curious. I'm Bruce Bryan. This is Theresa Dorlini from CIRCLE Design Studio. I was gonna ask, so when you two argue, do you tend to argue in the living room or in the kitchen? I'm sure that's not one of the questions. Sure. But do you want an island between you to keep you…anyway, nothing like that.

Theresa Dorlini: Maybe they argue in the shower. Who knows?

DESIGNING MOUNTAIN AND LAKE RETREATS

Bruce C. Bryan: There you go. That's right. So I guess, probably with the high-end, I'm thinking more on the residential side, with the high-end, customized solutions that you're providing, it might be a little hard to get traction in a narrow geographic area with your approach. Has that kind of caused you to broaden your approach in terms of regions or other parts of the state? Or how do you all end up working with the customers and the clients that you work with?

Theresa Dorlini: Yeah. I think the clients, by the time they find us, have done their research on us, which is why they end up being the best clients anyway. But in terms of region, I think we're sort of settling into a nice spot right now with Smith Mountain Lake. I think after COVID there were a lot of people sort of fleeing, you know, New York and DC just to kinda get away from the cities, and I think that that's kind of starting to become our sweet spot are these getaways, mountain getaways, lake getaways. So I don't know if we targeted that or it just–

Bruce C. Bryan: –happened naturally. It's kind of because of the word-of-mouth and organically.

Theresa Dorlini: Yeah...

Bruce C. Bryan: The way referrals happen. So people think, and when they go to your website or if, people are listening and they... If you're doing it while you're driving, please don't go to the website right now. But if people wanted to go look, they'll see that what you do plays, and I think is perceived to play really well, in the desert or in big mountains. I know you went to Arizona State. But you're also finding that it's working well in the hills and in the woods and like you just said, by the lake. Talk a little bit about that.

Theresa Dorlini: I think it's just understanding the importance of setting, and really allowing the landscape to dictate the architecture. I think, when you go to university out in Arizona, there's just so much great desert landscape out there, and a lot of the architects out there are really focused on building for that setting and sometimes building around mountains and rockscapes and things like that. So you have to be sensitive. I think having an understanding of that, having an understanding of the climate, just for conditioning reasons.

SETTING, LANDSCAPE, AND ARCHITECTURAL CONTEXT

Bruce C. Bryan: The way the windows face and things like that.

Theresa Dorlini: Yeah.

Bruce C. Bryan: It is interesting to me because people out west–and I've spent a lot of time in Arizona–they talk about how beautiful it is here in Virginia, and people in Virginia talk about how beautiful it is in the desert, and that seems to be something that comes up in a lot of these conversations. I'm betting when you do some of these bigger projects, people might like to kinda consider you their secret weapon, let's say. And that may mean getting referrals isn't as easy as one might think. Perhaps you can expound on that some because I would think that you're doing this amazing work, but people might want to think it was their idea or they may not wanna reveal how closely they worked with you and the work that your company might have done.

Theresa Dorlini: I think sometimes, there are definitely clients who maybe missed their calling as an architect or a designer and wanna live vicariously, but that's part of the process. We have had clients where they really wanted to be involved. But then we also have clients who are just very private just because of who they are, and that sort of dictates what we can show and maybe also who we're crediting.

Bruce C. Bryan: Yeah, the kind of marketing pieces you can do–yeah...obviously.

Theresa Dorlini: Yeah.

CREATIVE DIRECTION AND MANAGING CLIENT INSPIRATION

Bruce C. Bryan: I think that everyone has a boss or a client, and you do as well, I bet. But what do you do when someone pushes you just a little bit too far and starts to take that creativity and make it maybe a little more bland or more mainstream than you like? That’s gotta be hard for you.

Theresa Dorlini: We try to be really intentional and deliberate about what the design intent is, and stating that very early, and that comes from the client. It's gotten worse since Pinterest and Instagram.

Bruce C. Bryan: I was gonna go a step further, maybe worse since HGTV.

Theresa Dorlini: Yeah.

Bruce C. Bryan: All your work gets done in about 22 minutes. Is that right? Right. Unless it's 44. Right. Is that how pretty much everything's handled? Really quick, right?

Theresa Dorlini: Exactly, yeah. I think that getting the client to come back to what that design intent is, that statement, and really reeling them in because once we start a process, it's like we start off and it's Spanish mission, and then they’re like, "Nope, we went here and we saw this." And I go, "Well, just because you saw that, that doesn't mean that that tile belongs in this house."

Bruce C. Bryan: Right.

Theresa Dorlini: Or just because you like that roof line now, this is where we were. You have to be pretty firm. But I think there's a lot of exploration in the beginning and a lot of freedom in the beginning to get to know them and draw all those things out so that we're not shutting them down. We're hearing everything. But at some point, you need to stop, and we have to facilitate them, and steward them, in a way–

Bruce C. Bryan: –through that process.

Theresa Dorlini: Yeah.

Bruce C. Bryan: When we come back, I'd like to talk more about how this architectural and design work fits into other creative outlets that you've been exercising.

DESIGN-BUILD AND SIGNATURE CABINETRY

Bruce C. Bryan: CIRCLE Design Studio started with architecture and interior design, and now you've grown. Talk a little bit more about how that's happened.

Theresa Dorlini: Yeah. We've expanded and have become a Class A contractor, so we can do the largest projects possible. And mostly, going after and having the contractor's license was, to be honest, to have more control over the design process and who the subs were that were executing the work. So there's a little bit of a control freak in both myself and my husband. But in terms of the other things that we've done…Signature by Circle is our custom cabinetry line. And again, the control freak in me was like, “If I'm going to be designing the cabinetry, why not also be able to supply the cabinets and use a product that I believe in?”

Bruce C. Bryan: Yeah. You want precise work from your surgeons—from your architects, your builders, and—not saying you're a surgeon. But there's certain industries where precision's important, right? So looking at it, stepping back, looking at it a little more holistically, what are you learning right now?

CREATIVE SABBATICALS AND FURNITURE DESIGN

Theresa Dorlini: Oh, gosh. I'm like professionally, personally, so—

Bruce C. Bryan: —many lessons.

Theresa Dorlini: So many lessons. The joke in the office is that I'm in my midlife crisis. There's lots of things that are contributing to that. But I think I’m just a naturally curious person, and there's so many things that I want to pursue. I’m pursuing furniture design and I recently was on a six-month sabbatical. I actually extended it, but creative sabbatical, and that was just because I wanted to actually dig in and take the time that I needed to pursue furniture design and product design, which has always been a goal. I design custom pieces for clients but have never gotten into the manufactured furniture realm.

Bruce C. Bryan: The idea of furniture design. Mm-hmm. So focusing, kinda narrowing you back into that part and maybe things related to design, what have you learned? And maybe, maybe if it’s appropriate, and if you're okay with it, during that sabbatical, which I think professionally is such a great thing for people if they're in a position where they can do it, especially if you come out with practical things. What kinds of things did you come out of that or are you coming out of that with?

Theresa Dorlini: I think it's a deeper knowledge of the manufacturing process. I think it's a deeper knowledge of what the capabilities still are in this country. A lot of the furnishings are made overseas, you know—Vietnam, China, things like that. I guess I just had that nostalgic love of, you know…it's maybe the mid-century and Eames and all of this exploration, and I think that the furniture industry is a little bit different than that now. I’m learning that I'm someone also who…I like ideas, but I like to know how things are made. And if I know how something is made and I know parameters and things like that, I actually design better. So understanding what different factories’ capabilities are helps me to become a better designer. I think what I'm learning now is that you just don't have access to that level, in a lot of ways. It's not the great furniture era that it used to be in this country.

Theresa Dorlini: Yeah, I mean, creativity is just so fluid. You never really know where the spark is gonna come from or where the inspiration comes from. It's a fluid process, and I just feel like as long as you're open to it, the great thing about sort of slowing down and taking a sabbatical, and weeding out some of the noise of everyday life, is that you can hear some of the inspiration.

Bruce C. Bryan: Interesting. Are there themes to what you create, Theresa?

Theresa Dorlini: Yeah, there are a lot of different themes. The materials that I like to work with in furnishings are metal, leather, glass. I'm a modernist at heart. But I also started off in biology and medical illustration, so a lot of things that I look at have to do with the human form, skeletal structures. I love a good chair with an exoskeleton.That's my thing. I think the more that you open yourself up and you are curious and can dabble here and there and actually are interested in lots of different fields and topics, I think that that makes your design better.

WHERE CREATIVE INSPIRATION COMES FROM

Bruce C. Bryan: You alluded to this, but where do your ideas come from, you and your husband, in the ways you create things? And I mean that generally, because I'm curious where the ideas come from.

Theresa Dorlini: I think sometimes it can be from the material and its capabilities, or sometimes…I give an example of my corset chair, which is a chair that—I had an idea, and it's based off of Madonna's Vogue video. The scene where you just sort of see the back of her corset. It's pretty iconic. I think as any kid, you know...I was born in 1977, but the '90s Madonna era was pretty key in forming my visual aesthetic. So that's a chair that came from that, and who knows what things kind of stick in your mind for a really long time and how they're gonna come out. So I think it's being open and I think always either sketching or recording or just taking note, having your eyes open.

Bruce C. Bryan: So we talked about HGTV a little bit earlier. And it's probably a mixed blessing, but people are, it seems, paying more attention to their homes now and to their spaces. But the TV shows make it look so easy, 'cause they get to edit. Like Big Jim edits my show all the time and makes it look better than it is, right? Or sound better than it does. But it's kind of a mixed blessing, right?

Theresa Dorlini: Yeah, I think it's a mixed blessing. I hope by now everyone knows that the shows are entertainment. But sometimes they still come into our office and think that it should take 22 minutes and that you should sledgehammer upper cabinets instead of just taking them down. However people, whatever their perception is of design, I think hopefully after they work with us and our team and our firm, they realize what the design process actually is and what goes into it.

THE VALUE OF TRUST AND CREATIVE FREEDOM

Bruce C. Bryan: When I ask you about some projects, and it can be in any of the genres that you've loved, what projects come to mind, and what is it about those projects that you really love? And you don't have to list the actual project. But as they come to your mind, what is it about those projects, and what is it that you've loved?

Theresa Dorlini: I love the clients who are willing to take risks. I love the clients who know that they came to us for our expertise and trust us. I like the clients who like to be pushed a little bit. Obviously I'm a modernist, but when you design for a client, you should be able to be fluent in all aesthetic styles, things like that. When things are maybe too straightforward and a client comes in and just says, "This is the style I want," or whatever, I find that those are a little bit boring, because if it's already been done, why do we wanna do it? I think also clients and projects who value design. They value high detail. They value the broad view, but then they wanna know that all of those fine details that you see up close are really taken care of. I think a lot of times clients or just the general public, they're like, "Oh, well of course you like the really big budget ones." I don't know that that's necessarily the case because sometimes when you have such a big budget, it doesn't push you. You don't—

Bruce C. Bryan: —need to be or wanna be pushed.

Theresa Dorlini: Right. You don't push the creative muscle or build the creative muscle because you don't have to.

Bruce C. Bryan: Some of those clients you described, it feels like it might be a little bit like catching lightning in a bottle though. And so do you have specific memories, it sounds like you do, of people that have given you room and space to try new things, be a little more daring?

Theresa Dorlini: Yeah. I think that there's a ton. I tend to be one who will push them even more, because, as maybe sort of the creative kind of visionary, during all of the projects, I see the end product almost immediately. Especially if it's a renovation. You just have—

Bruce C. Bryan: —to bring people along to where you are.

Theresa Dorlini: Mhm.

Bruce C. Bryan: That makes sense. That's Theresa Dorlini. I'm Bruce Bryan. This is Naturally Curious. How do you know when you've done a good job?

Theresa Dorlini: I know I've done a good job when the client cries and gives me a hug usually. But also, because we are so heavily invested in the visualization process and 3D and clients always say, "Oh my gosh" when they walk in. "This looks…here it is in real life...this looks just like the rendering." And you're like, "Yep, that's the point."

Bruce C. Bryan: What, Theresa, feeds your soul when it comes to doing this kind of work?

Theresa Dorlini: I mean, ultimately, I love the clients being happy, but what feeds my soul is being given the creative freedom. Having a client trust me and trust the vision and trust that our team is gonna execute it pretty close to perfection, and then seeing the vision come alive. Because if you're a creative and you have this vision, it's like birthing a baby. You want it to turn out well and…I have four kids, so everything comes down to this analogy of birthing babies. But it's like the process of, say, seeing an ultrasound picture is kind of like seeing the 3D renderings for the first time, you know?

Bruce C. Bryan: When they come out as real live people or a real live project, that's something different.

Theresa Dorlini: Yeah.

Bruce C. Bryan: I have a quick question and then we're gonna have to wrap it up here, but there is a bonus segment. Would you classify yourself as an artist, or does that word bother or offend you?

Theresa Dorlini: I don't think it bothers or offends me. I think I'm an artist to a certain degree, but there's so many constraints and parameters in architecture and design that I can't just be an artist. So yeah, designer more than anything else. I'm Bruce Bryan. Thank you for listening.